Chapel Hill chuckle o' the day

From the N&O: It looks like some of our Chamber of Commerce types down in the hill of chapel to the south of the Bull City might be feeling a bit tweaked over the urban revitalization happening in Durham and Raleigh--

"You're rich, you're mostly white, you're the slowest-growing area [in North Carolina] that isn't going backward," [Ted Abernathy of the Southern Growth Policies Board] said. "Your housing is the highest priced."

"You used to be the coolest place," he said.

But in recent years, Durham and Raleigh have been revitalizing their downtowns, giving residents and businesses less reason to come to Chapel Hill.

Aaron Nelson, president of the Chapel Hill-Carrboro Chamber of Commerce, acknowledged Chapel Hill has lost its edge.

Durham's "American Tobacco [complex] can eat our lunch," he said. "WUNC Radio broadcasting from American Tobacco kills me every time."

Tip to Chapel Hill: keep kicking out town institutions like the Somerhill Gallery -- which was literally forced out of the Eastgate Shopping Center by its owner, only to find a much more attractive, much larger home in downtown Durham -- and we'll keep the trend moving, no?

Seriously, what is there that's interesting in Chapel Hill? OK, A Southern Season is worth a visit, but is there really anything else worth stopping there for?

(It's an honest question; the wife and I have lived in Durham for several years but we go to Raleigh more often than we do Chapel Hill. Every time we've been into Orange Co., we've found Carrboro compelling but Chapel Hill just sort of there, a bit staid.)

Comments

[David McMullen]

I remember the days when Chapel Hill was a cool place and Carrboro wasn't. But Chapel Hill simply got too expensive and too gentrified for a lot of people, and they moved to Carrboro. Ditto the "cool" stuff - Franklin Street rents just got too expensive.

If you look closely, you can see the beginnings of Carrboro heading down that same path. The "cool" people and stuff are starting to move down the road to Pittsboro, of all places.

[Christina Askounis]

I find it amusing that Chapel Hill only now seems to be cottoning on to the realization that it is bland and boring next to our vibrant Bull City--which has fabulous restaurants in all price ranges (hooray for Foster's Market and Guglhupf!), great shopping on Ninth Street, including the incomparable Regulator Bookshop, the charming Ox and Rabbit, Vaguely Reminiscent and of course our own Italian gelato/espresso cafe, Francesca's; then there's the beautiful home of Durham Bulls baseball, the new performing arts center, our beloved jewel box of a theater, the Carolina, and best of all, a people-scape unmatched by any other city in NC. As for "this is WUNC broadcasting from American Tobacco," I just wish they'd add two little words: "in Durham." But I guess it must stick in their craw.

[duncan]

Having lived in Chapel Hill several years before moving here, I could have pretty much say the same thing about Durham. Since there's plenty of places to hang out and eat and drink, Durham didn't interest me that much except for the occasional Bulls game and trips to big box stores. Chapel Hill still has my favorite bar, I still have to go to Pepper's Pizza every now and then and UNC campus is still gorgeous despite the construction.

All that said, their downtown has been stagnant while Durham and Raleigh have built up. They've put in some very nice mixed use communities and are building stuff all around, but Franklin street is becoming less and less interesting (except for the condos going up on Rosemary). Part of this is by design because the town really wants to remain a town and retain that sort of small town charm. So while all everyone around them wants to do is build, grow, and renovate as fast as they can, Chapel Hill keeps tapping the brake. There is some virtue in that but it causes the obvious problem that the place doesn't stay fresh, businesses don't want to move to old buildings when there is an awesome new space just 30 minutes away the next town over, and visitors go find something new.

Eventually they are going to just have to bite all the way down on the bullet. If nothing else, UNC will force them do something as they always want to expand and will threaten to just dominate the town even more than they already do.

[erin]

If Trader Joe's would open in Durham, I would probably go to Chapel Hill once in a blue moon.

[B]

Still lots of good live music in CH, though I've gone over a lot less since the Pinhook opened.

Actually, a neighbor of mine and I went over to CH one Friday evening last year to take in the Hunter Thompson doc playing at the theater on Franklin. We figured we'd go over a little early and just pop in somewhere for a burger and a beer. We kept looking for an uncomplicated place to do that, but everywhere was either too crowded or too posh for what we had in mind. We eventually ran into a friend of mine who lives there, and asked him for a recommendation.

His response: "yeah, you probably should have just stayed in Durham for that."

[Ellen C]

I go to Chapel Hill to work (UNC Hospital) and visit my daughter (a senior at the university), catch an occasional movie at the independent Chelsea theater, and very rarely any other time. I think partly it's because the downtown parking is so wicked awful, and--in the insult to injury department--you have to pay. Heck, the parking everywhere is awful. I might go to Trader Joe's more often if that damnable Eastgate parking lot didn't have a main street running through the middle of it. And Southern Season is no longer a draw for me; it's badly laid out. A store where they have to hand out maps at the entrance is just not enticing.

[Charlie B.]

Trader Joe's...Chelsea Theater (and the great Ethiopian restaurant in the same shopping center)...comparative shopping at Performance Bicycles...UNC Med Center...music venues (though, strictly, they're in Carrboro) -- there are a few reasons to go to Chapel Hill once a month.

CH is good for those aged 17-24.

[Samantha E.]

I go to CH for Trader Joe's, Margaret's Cantina, and the dentist at UNC's dental school. That's pretty much it. I used to go much more frequently when I first moved here 9 years ago, but parking challenges, some changes in the restaurant scene, and more options in Durham now are part of the reason why I don't go as much now. That said, I still appreciate the long walkable stretch (with stuff to see and do) that is Franklin St starting in the university area continuing over to Carrboro, and the much more bike-friendly environment. I love living in Durham, but we can do better, especially if we can improve our "mosey" factor.

[aburtch]

I love Samantha's comment about Durham's "mosey" factor. Imagine what it would be like if the Brightleaf Square area was connected to the ATC / DPAC area with a well-lit, easily walkable path and commercial establishments along the way. Then connect Brightleaf to the growing West Village area and you'd have quite a spread.

But there's always room for improvement. As it stands now the Bull City is head and shoulders above Chapel Hill in my eyes.

[Kat]

I work at UNC and live in Durham. Franklin St. is a nightmare. I hate going down there now between the drunk, partying college students and the pushy panhandlers--which wouldn't bother me as much if one of them wasn't a guy that has been panhandling on Franklin St. for as long as I can remember. And more local places continue to close and be replaced by chains--qdoba, chipotle, panera, noodle co. is the latest. Interestingly, a few great local businesses have given up in Carrboro and have moved to Elliot Rd.--Phydeaux and Yarns Etc. (although I actually need to try out the yarn store on Ninth St., because Yarns Etc. has hours designed to make it seem like only housewives and retired people deserve to knit as a hobby.). The two Elliot Rd. shopping centers have also gotten 3 Cups, Locopops, and a new locally owned store that sells ecofriendly stuff. Whole Foods is expanding too. Elliot Rd. is a hopping place that used to be seriously going downhill. I wish the new company that owns U-Mall would get their act together and start improving it. It is a pretty unique place and could be awesome. It is the only mall left in the triangle where you can still by aspirin, but also has some cool local stuff, and some useful chain stores and isn't as crazy as the mega-malls.

[Erik]

I lived in CH for 5 years before moving to Durham. I have a lot more love for Durham and as someone mentioned CH is much more suited for students (I've met lots of Dukies in CH too). But there are still plenty of things to do there.

Obviously the big draw is the University and that all depends on what is going on there. Look for events at Memorial Hall - that's a terrific venue and some of the best shows I've ever been to were there (Sufjan Stevens, The Roots, Andrew Bird, etc.). I also think the Ackland Art Museum is very underrated and sometimes has fantastic exhibits.

I also think some of the restaurants are very good. I still think Lantern is the best restaurant in the area when you take quality of food, price, atmosphere, and service into account. I also love Talulla's which has great Turkish food.

If I were to recommend a good day in Chapel Hill (without going to Carrboro), it would probably be this:

Go to Pepper's Pizza for lunch (best pizza in the area in my opinion). Walk around campus, particularly the Forest Theatre and arboretum, then hit up the Ackland Art Museum. Early dinner at Lantern, then either catch a show at Memorial Hall or The Cave or catch a movie at either the Varsity or Chelsea Theater if there are no good shows that night. That's a pretty decent day.

But yeah, Durham is way more compelling than Chapel Hill in my opinion. Chapel Hill is what it is - it was a great place to go to grad school, but I had no desire to stick around afterwards.

[Erik]

I also love the "mosey" comment. I was just thinking about that last night when I went to Brighleaf for dinner. Most of the restaurants were packed, but it just didn't feel like there were many people there. People just don't walk around much and the lighting is terrible (Fuller St needs some streetlights immediately). That's definitely one thing Chapel Hill has on Durham - even if it doesn't have as interesting places or restaurants, there are always more people walking around.

By the way, part of that is due to the fact that there is limited parking (meaning people have to park a few blocks away and then walk past all of the shops). I'm one of those people who think that limiting parking and making people pay for what exists is actually a good thing for shopping areas (anyone ever tried to park in Boston, New York, San Francisco, etc.? Pretty walkable, interesting places, no?).

[Myers Sugg]

I know we can't live in the past, but when I was in school at Chapel Hill in the late 80's, early 90's, Franklin St was cool, for there were few chains, and no national chains as I can recall. On a recent drive to Carrboro (to Fitch Lumber, cause they have stuff you can't get other places), I came up Franklin St. It was a sad sight when what I saw what appeared to be a another junky looking chain restaurant entitled "Cluck-U." It is in the space of what was Peppers or Record Bar, but I'm not certain. They may have great food, but the bright purple and yellow paint just screamed "crapola."

I've always been told rents are outrageous and these costs preclude lower capital, but potentially viable, businesses to consider Franklin St. Additionally, it is my view that many of these buildings could use some serious investment. It's a shame that the impression I get is that of greedy property owners only caring about their signifiant revenue stream, without looking at the bigger picture of what positive they could do to improve the overall flavor of that strip, and Chapel Hill in general.

Myers Sugg

[Jared]

Until Durham creates a more walkable environment, despite it being more interesting (and has more potential to be cooler, etc.), it can't really compete with CH.

[Dan]

I love Durham and enjoy this blog, but the tendency to feel the need to bash Chapel Hill, Cary, Raleigh, wherever is off-putting. It screams of insecurity among Durhamites (I myself lived happily in Durham for years) to always find the need to proclaim the town's coolness and everyone else's perceived blandness. Sure, Durham has many great things going for it. And we all know Durham has plenty of challenges too. I'd rather see Durhamites resist the urge to bash other towns and focus on their own. In short, there can be a Bull City Rising without the rest of the Triangle falling, right?

As for chains in Chapel Hill's downtown, sure it ain't the hipster scene it was in the '80s, but have you noticed the same is true for just about everywhere? And there are still many independent restaurants and stores on Franklin St (more than there are in downtown Durham, I'd say). Although I won't visit it, it won't be such a horrible thing when a Starbuck's lands in downtown Durham.

[hal5477]

Chapel Hill has better looking women. Hands down. If there is a good looking woman in Durham, she is from somewhere else.

[Andrew Edmonds]

>>As for "this is WUNC broadcasting from American Tobacco," I just wish they'd add two little words: "in Durham."

Amen to that.

The State of Things' Frank Stasio lives in Durham, so I don't know why he wouldn't/couldn't add those two words. I think Joe and Terry Graedon of the Peoples Pharmacy say them.

I suppose "in Durham" would seem redundant to anyone who grew up in this area ("of course American Tobacco is in Durham"), but we all know how few natives there are. Plus, it's a statewide broadcast.

C'mon! Give the people what they want!

[Alan]

I agree completely with the comment about women in Durham. There are very few attractive single women on a regular basis, in and around the downtown. There are attractive women, but 9 times out of 10 they have a ring or are visiting. I think Durham will not have young single women hanging out downtown in any mass until they feel safe. Has anyone seen a bike patrol lately. I've seen one in the past month and it consisted of 4 officers riding together. This doesn't help. Add in the terrible sidewalks and poorly lit streets/alleys and the general unsafe feeling multiplies.

[Erik]

I think the sidewalks within the downtown loop are pretty good, but as someone else pointed out, the bigger problem is the connectivity between the different shopping areas (Ninth St, Brightleaf, within the loop, ATC, etc.). The addition of sidewalks along Pettigrew St in conjunction with Durham Station is a start, but there is still lots of work to be done, particularly with the streetlights.

[Joshua Allen]

Agree on the connectivity of Brightleaf with ATC/DPAC. That would vastly improve downtown Durham.

As for CH, I used to go there a lot 10 years ago, but find it much less appealing today. My favorite place was the West End Wine Bar. Since they are setting up shop in Durham soon, that's one less reason to trek to CH. Today, Franklin Street is, frankly, boring. It is walkable but there are a lot of dead spots (at least dead from places I want to stop) along the way. There is no good place for desserts, except for Locopops, which is based in Durham, anyway. There are only 3 restaurants in CH that I care for: Elaine's, Lantern, and the French restaurant in the Courtyard.

I do like Southern Season, but I used to love Fowler's in Durham way more. Fowler's was my favorite store anywhere and I really, really, really miss it. Parker & Otis is OK, but just not the same.

[John A]

Well I live in Carrboro and work in Durham. And I find this all extremely funny.

[sgwaltney]

I think someone needs to forward this blog to the Trader Joe's main office about where some pint up demand might be.

[JPL]

Someone already mentioned it, but since Blue Nile closed (*sniff*), you have to go to Chapel Hill to get Ethiopian food. Fortunately Queen of Sheba's new location at the Timberlyne shopping center is more accessible from Durham. It makes a great dinner/movie combo with the Chelsea Theatre, especially if the Carolina happens to not be showing what I want to see.

[Michael Bacon]

The thing is, I have the same trouble answering my grad school peers at UNC when they ask me why they should go to Durham. Well, um, it all depends on what you're looking for.

There's all sorts of ways to spend a quality evening in Chapel Hill at local businesses (albeit not in the main two blocks of Franklin St.), but you can do that in Durham too, so why would you? Well, I work over on W. Franklin St. (the part of the street that still has affordable rents and cool local businesses), and it's the best neighborhood I've ever had an office in, by a long, long shot, but you don't really need to drive 20 minutes just to get a gyro platter at Med. Deli or hit the Indian buffets. Pizzeria III is probably the best place in the Triangle to watch big European soccer matches, but what if you just don't care?

Chapel Hill has nothing to match American Tobacco, but Durham has nothing to match Southern Village. It all depends on if you're looking for a jazz concert or a movie on the lawn. And frankly, I'm a strong proponent of people being happy where they are. So what if I'd never go to Chapel Hill if I didn't work there? (Well, there's UNC games, but anyway...) Does that somehow make us better? That's the same drivel Raleigh peddled for years about this side of the Triangle.

Speaking of, Kevin, this is where you and I don't see eye to eye. I have some good reasons to go to Chapel Hill, but short of a job or visiting friends who live there, I can't for the life of me figure out why any Durhamite would ever want to drive to Raleigh for anything. What the hell could possibly be worth that trek? The last time I got over there was for Avenue Q, and, well, with the DPAC about to eat Broadway South for a midnight snack, I don't imagine that will happen any time soon.

[Emily]

"As for chains in Chapel Hill's downtown, sure it ain't the hipster scene it was in the '80s, but have you noticed the same is true for just about everywhere? And there are still many independent restaurants and stores on Franklin St (more than there are in downtown Durham, I'd say). Although I won't visit it, it won't be such a horrible thing when a Starbuck's lands in downtown Durham."

Downtown Durham proper has one chain restaurant, McDonald's. There are the chain stores on Broad and Main (Whole Foods, Ben and Jerry's), but very few other than those. And there was a Starbucks in the ATC, but it closed and (local) Saladelia took its place.

[jacob]

It's true that when I go to that side of the Triangle, I'm usually going to Carrboro, not Chapel Hill. But there are places in Chapel Hill I like, and that I'm willing to make the trek to. Someone has already mentioned the Chelsea Theater. There's also Three Cups and Sandwich. The Bookshop is among the best used bookstores in the area, if not the best. There's also the Internationalist. Do I go there a lot? No. But certainly more than I go to Raleigh.

[Ross Grady]

I moved to Chapel Hill from Raleigh in 1996 because I was spending more time in Chapel Hill than in Raleigh. I moved to Durham in 2008 for the same reason.

Having said that, while I dearly love Kelli & Billy at Toast, Sandwhich in Chapel Hill is still the best sandwich in the Triangle, hands down. Not a week goes by that I don't wish for a Sandwhich outpost in RTP.

It is telling, however, that I don't think I've made the trek back to Chapel Hill to eat at Sandwhich since I moved. It's good, but it's not *that* good ;-)

While we're talking food (and really, that's the only thing worth talking about when comparing Triangle cities, isn't it?), the burgers at Buns on Columbia St in Chapel Hill are quite possibly best-in-the-Triangle material as well. As good as the Federal burger can be, Buns very nearly *is* special-trip-worthy.

There are still more live-music venues in Chapel Hill (the Franklin/Rosemary trifecta of Local 506, The Cave & Nightlight is hard to beat), but now that I'm old & tired, I only go to maybe one show a week, and the Pinhook, being nonsmoking & a few blocks from my house, pretty much can't lose.

I *do* have to second the previous commenter who asked you just exactly *what* you guys are finding to do in *Raleigh,* of all places . . . . hockey? IMAX movies? Hot dogs at the Roast Grill (mmmmmmmm)? I suppose I'll admit I'm looking forward to the opening of the new expanded NC Museum of Art, but beyond that . . . . what?

[shane]

I need Trader Joes in Durham--NEED IT--how about Whole Foods expanding (sorry to bring that up!) and Trader Joes moving into their old spot! Or even better, Trader Joes finding a spot smack dab between ATC and Brightleaf--now that would rock!

[hovercraft]

But if we're so great in Durham, why don't we have a head shop? Chapel Hill has its uses...

[Joshua Allen]

I'm so glad to hear Queen of Sheba reopened. I thought they were gone for good. So that's a great reason for me to return to CH!!!

One last thought: The main reason I became disillusioned with CH is that I realized it's mostly just strip malls and suburbia. Since I don't find Franklin St. very appealing anymore, I just don't find CH that appealing. It's just an overpriced, liberal version of Cary. Seriously, someone please explain to me the difference between CH and Cary if you just take Franklin St. out of the picture.

And yes, I know that Durham has its lot of strip malls and such, but the core of Durham, including downtown loop, ATHD, Brightleaf, West Village, Durham Central Park, Ninth St/Broad St. area, Duke, NC Central area, and the in town neighborhoods are awesome, eclectic, interesting, and a much, much larger area than W. Franklin St.

[Joshua Allen]

One more reason to go to CH: Cafe Driade! Now that's one thing CH has that we just can't compare to.

[TSQ75]

Very Good point, Hovercraft ; )

and sorry, but WTF is the commentary on who has hotter women?

Personally, i cant stand going to CH. being partnered with a musican, I consistently groan over the prospect of a gig in CH. between the parking, the frat kids, and the "Cool Club Hipsters" crawling all over the place there, i'm literally itching to get back to durham

[Lionel]

The Durham police are a joke, compared to other communities. Hell, compared to ANY community. An absolute joke.
And the women here are NOT attractive.

[Ray Gronberg]

The noodle place on W. Franklin is a vast improvement on what was there, which was nothing for about eight years after the Wicked Burrito bit the dust.

[Cara]

This discussion about attractiveness of Durham's women is completely cracking me up. If I can chime in, D-town has way more cute lesbians.

[KeepDurhamDifferent!]

The only reasons I go to CH/Carrboro are for Ethiopian food and The Friendly Barber Shop, where you can still get a haircut with local flavor for $12.

The Durham barber acros from the Marriott cuts hair for $9 on Wednesdays, but they are sometimes challenged when cutting white people's hair.

[Jonn]

" The main reason I became disillusioned with CH is that I realized it's mostly just strip malls and suburbia."

That's a completely untrue statement, Chapel Hill and Carrboro have the very few strip malls in comparison with the rest of the Triangle.

But yeah Chapel Hill is boring unless you go to UNC. I live in Carrboro and that's boring in a totally different way. The problem is their no-growth policies..houses/apartments go to the highest bidder and the community has become more elite. So yeah, i'm making the Durham move in a couple of months. Wow, you mean i dont have to pay $1,000 for a 2 bedroom house that is smaller than a mobile home????

[bb]

Uh, the Wicked Burrito closed?

Chapel Hill ladies are not hotter, they're only younger per capita. When I lived there, I could see the average age of my female companionship staying the roughly the same while I gradually grew older and grayer. Each successive date I went out on I felt more and more like a cradle robber. Then I moved to Durham, and realized this city is packed with extremely attractive over 30 crowd, gay or straight. I ain't leaving.

[Laura]

Emily @ 1/24 10:55 pm:

Downtown Durham has another chain, the Subway in the basement of the County Administrative building. But it's not open on the weekends and closes at like 3 or 4 pm during the week.

Chapel Hill will never be cooler than Carrboro, ever. Any town who runs off the hot dog man can't help but suck.

[snaggletooth]

I like Sugarland a whole bunch on Franklin St, def. worth visiting.. The Yogurt Pump is also a nice desert kind of place. The bar scene in general in CH is nice during the summer... And to another point, Chapel Hill and Carrboro kind of run together to form a nice casual downtown feeling, that has appeal on its own. One big strip of bars, restaurants, cafes, etc.. its nice, so is Durham, so is Raliegh, this is truly a good place to live.